I Had a Friendly Chat with Gavin Ortlund

About this sermon

In this episode Trent sits down with Protestant apologist Gavin Ortlund to discuss what they agree and disagree about. To support this channel: https://www.patreon.com/counseloftrent [NEW] Counsel of Trent merch: https://shop.catholic.com/apologists-alley/trent-horn-resources/ Be sure to keep up with our socials! https://www.tiktok.com/@counseloftrent https://www.twitter.com/counseloftrent https://www.instagram.com/counseloftrentpodcast 0:00 Introduction 1:17 Gavin’s background in apologetics 3:25 Why Trent focuses on more than Catholic-Protestant debates 5:11 Why Gavin entered Protestant apologetics 7:03 Comparing the best of Catholicism and Protestantism 8:42 Where Catholics and Protestants can work together 11:30 Scholarship, popular apologetics, and bad arguments 13:07 Keeping goodwill in Catholic-Protestant debate 14:11 Trent and Gavin’s biblical slavery debate 15:51 Drawing lines while defending the gospel together 17:27 Theological triage and ranking doctrines 18:18 Mere Christianity vs. the fullness of Christian belief 19:38 Is Catholicism more important than Jesus? 21:20 Why internal disagreements can get more heated 23:10 How to disagree without destroying relationships 25:03 How the internet distorts theological conflict 26:08 Reviewing scripts and keeping rebuttals charitable 28:08 Misrepresentation, falsehoods, and online controversy 29:48 “Tune out the noise and meet needs” 30:36 St. Paul, apologetics, and internet criticism 33:38 Is online drama a spiritual distraction? 33:52 Why Trent and Gavin stay online 36:03 Raising up better Christian apologists 37:27 Permissible, obligatory, and forbidden doctrines 38:48 Gavin’s core objection to Catholicism 40:11 Mary’s Assumption, Dormition, and binding the conscience 41:07 Where do Catholics and Protestants draw Christianity’s boundaries? 42:34 Hard doctrines: Catholicism, hell, and submission to Christ 45:40 Annihilationism, Kirk Cameron, and Christian disagreement 46:14 Catholic and Protestant art, films, and C. S. Lewis 48:04 Mary’s Assumption and historical evidence 49:55 Mormonism, the Trinity, and true worship 50:34 Classical theism and first-rank doctrines 52:50 Divine simplicity, fine-tuning, and apologetics 54:27 The Incarnation and the causes of the Reformation 55:18 Sola scriptura, justification, and authority 56:15 Icon veneration and doctrinal development 58:31 Sola scriptura and the limits of Christian practice 1:01:00 What does sola scriptura actually mean? 1:02:20 What evidence would justify an obligatory doctrine? 1:04:08 How do Christians determine first-rank doctrines? 1:06:35 Does disagreement refute sola scriptura? 1:07:40 Protestant disunity and Catholic ecclesial authority 1:10:16 The strongest argument against Protestantism 1:10:36 Does Catholicism solve doctrinal disagreement? 1:13:52 Trent’s “one reason” he is not Protestant 1:14:10 The New Testament canon and the “gap problem” 1:15:04 Scripture, authorship, and scholarly criticism 1:18:39 Bishops, scholarship, and historical arguments 1:20:00 Credobaptism, infant baptism, and salvation 1:24:56 Gavin on baptizing his children 1:27:03 Does baptism save? 1:29:44 Catholicism, Protestantism, and doctrinal development 1:32:13 Genesis, heliocentrism, and development in theology 1:32:56 Newman and measuring doctrinal development 1:33:40 Surrogacy, bioethics, and moral authority 1:35:50 What Protestants can learn from Catholics 1:37:26 Penance, forgiveness, and justification 1:38:35 Did the conversation make progress? 1:39:45 What would Catholic-Protestant progress look like? 1:42:35 Can non-Christians see our love? 1:43:52 Catholics and Protestants reaching the non-religious 1:45:03 Common mission and correcting caricatures 1:47:11 What Catholics can learn from evangelicals 1:47:49 Closing thoughts

Topics

• Relationships